‘The Opposite of Gaslighting’: Voters Told to Take Trump’s Fascism, Affinity for Hitler Seriously
Kamala Harris addresses Kelly's remarks at the White House
Fresh revelations from Donald Trump’s longest-serving White House chief of staff plainly lay bare Trump’s fascism as well as his startling affinity for Nazi leader Adolf Hitler.
New reporting has John Kelly — who worked in the Trump White House for about two years in the first half of his presidency — saying in recorded audio that Trump fits the definition of a fascist and that the former president looked for redeeming qualities in the man who led Germany on a horrific rampage during World War II and caused the extermination of millions of Jews and others in the Holocaust.
Although Trump has been called a fascist before and there have been whispers of his affection for Hitler, Kelly’s new, clear disclosures should be taken with a heightened level of seriousness and weight, according to a variety of journalists and others.
Trump long has been using xenophobic political rhetoric reminiscent of Nazi Germany during the campaign.
Michael Schmidt, of the New York Times, put out his recording of his conversation with Kelly, who also is a retired U.S. Marine Corps general.
“Well, I’m looking at the definition of fascism. It’s a far-right, authoritarian, ultra-nationalist political ideology and movement characterized by a dictatorial leader, centralized hypocrisy, militarism, forcible suppression of opposition, belief in a natural social hierarchy,” Kelly said. “So, certainly, in my experience, those are the kinds of things that he thinks would work better in terms of running America.
“You know, again, back to this issue of, you know, democracy is complicated, messy to operate, probably the worst kind of government there is, except for all the other ones. I think [Winston] Churchill once said that,” Kelly added. “And again, our Constitution, our founders built into the Constitution and into the way our government operates, built in a lot of checks and balances and it was — didn’t design to be streamlined and whatnot. So — but certainly, the former president is in the far-right area.
“He’s certainly an authoritarian, admires people who are dictators — he has said that. So, he certainly falls into the — into the general definition of — of fascist, for sure.”
Kelly also discussed how Trump viewed Hitler.
“He would, uh, he commented more than once that ‘You know, that Hitler did some good things, too,’” Kelly said. “And of course, if you know history, again I think he’s lacking in that, but if you know what history, you know what Hitler was all about, you’d be pretty hard to make an argument that he did anything good.”
It is critical for US voters to take Kelly’s revelations seriously in the run-up to the presidential election, according to journalist Anand Giridharadas.
“I think one of the features of — distinctive features of the United States, compared to other countries, is that we don’t necessarily think always in historical terms. We’re a country that lives in the present, thinks a lot about the future, a lot of other countries are obsessed with their past, but one — when I was growing up, one element of history that all Americans, including children, quote repeatedly, is kind of ‘Hitler bad,’ right? If Americans don’t know anything else about history, ‘Hitler bad’ is a pretty universal article of faith. That message has really broken through, even Americans who are not interested in history don’t read history books, ‘Hitler bad,’ very well firmly established foundation of the American mind.
“And so now a former American president trying to be an American president again, is trying to run on Hitler good. I think what John Kelly did, with Mike’s admirable reporting, only he could do this, is the opposite of gaslighting, right?” he added. “Because John Kelly is not the first person to call Donald Trump a fascist. It’s been said many times on this show, it’s been said on other shows, it’s been said by many courageous writers, it’s been said by some people going back years, but when it’s the former chief of staff to that person — when it’s someone with that kind of military record … — when it’s not an activist on campus, when it’s someone who chose after that career in the military to work for Donald Trump and try to implement his plans with whatever discomfort he harbored all along, it should be taken seriously, it should be a validation of some of the things other people have been saying.
“And it should be a reminder, I think particularly to those people who are most stubbornly in this kind of fascist camp right now, or are ‘fascist-curious,’ that if a person with John Kelly’s mind and training and history of service and up-close proximity to Donald Trump is saying he is a fascist, he is an authoritarian, he has serious vision around this, and he loves himself some Hitler, he thinks Hitler good, that should be taken seriously by maybe people who won’t take me seriously, or activists seriously, or anybody else, take John Kelly seriously if you don’t take us seriously,” Giridharadas said.
Trump’s Democratic opponent, Vice President Kamala Harris, seized on Kelly’s remarks in an appearance Wednesday at the White House.
“Donald Trump’s former chief of staff John Kelly, a retired four-star general, confirmed that while Donald Trump was president, he said he wanted generals like Adolf Hitler had. Donald Trump said that because he does not want a military that is loyal to the United States constitution. He wants a military that is loyal to him. He wants a military who will be loyal to him personally. One that will obey his orders even when he tells them to break the law or abandon their oath to the Constitution of the United States,” Harris said. “In just the past week, Donald Trump has repeatedly called his fellow Americans ‘the enemy from within.’
“And even said that he would use the United States military to go after American citizens. And let’s be clear about who he considers to be the ‘enemy from within,’” the vice president added. “Anyone who refuses to bend and knee or dares to criticize him would qualify, in his mind as the enemy within. Like judges. Like journalists. Like nonpartisan election officials.
“It is deeply troubling and incredibly dangerous that Donald Trump would invoke it off Hitler, the man who is responsible for the deaths of 6 million Jews and hundreds of thousands of Americans. All of this is further evidence for the American people of who Donald Trump really is,” she said. “This is a window into who Donald Trump really is. From the people who know him best. From the people who worked with him side-by-side in the Oval Office and in the Situation Room. And it is clear from John Kelly’s words that Donald Trump is someone who, I quote, ‘certainly falls into the general definition of fascists.’ Who, in fact, vowed to be a dictator on day one and vowed to use the military as his personal militia, to carry out his personal and political vendettas vendettas.
“Donald Trump is increasingly unhinged and unstable. And in a second term, people like John Kelly would not be there to be the guardrails against his propensities and his actions,” the vice president added. “Those who once tried to stop him from pursuing his worst impulses would no longer be there. And no longer be there to rein him in. So the bottom line is this. We know what Donald Trump wants. He wants unchecked power. The question, in 13 days, will be: What do the American people want?”
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